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May 15, 2026
03 Abby Ross - What this 3x CEO is building for climate resiliency
03 Abby Ross - What this 3x CEO is building for climate resiliency
00:00
21:07
Transcript
0:00
[upbeat music] All right, I just finished cutting together my conversation with Abby Ross. Abby's the CEO of The Resiliency Company. Uh, it's an organization in the philanthropic space.
0:12
She's doing a lot of innovative work when it comes to disaster preparedness and scaling organizations' abilities to give. She's much better at articulating it than I am, so I'll let her do that.
0:21
But it's fun to have a conversation with somebody that is doing big work that matters. A lot of money involved, but it's not about the money, it's about the real-world impact.
0:29
And so she was in San Diego when, uh, we had the chance to connect, so she's sitting outside at a conference that she was at and was gracious enough to spend the time.
0:37
But there's a little bit of audio trouble towards the end as a result, so I'll try and clean it up as much as I can. Apologies for that. But just a really good person.
0:44
Abby and her husband both, I've had the pleasure of working with both of them. We knew them when we lived in the Chicago area, and so it was fun to reconnect and have this chat. So I hope you get something out of it.
0:53
So I, I think of myself as, like, an entrepreneur through and through.
0:57
Um, how I either describe myself or identify is, like, I find, uh, what is a seemingly impossible problem, and then, like, run through a brick wall to try to solve it with, like, a pragmatic, like, approach.
1:12
So first in education where I was like, "All right, we need to get teams of teachers working together on critical thinking for students and reading and writing," which sounds kind of impossible when you look at lil- literacy rates across the country.
1:24
But what it actually just meant is we could use technology, and we could use, like, some human behavior design to create, and some great curriculum, uh, to do that.
1:33
And so that's what I spent, like, a decade doing, was building an ed tech, um, in that space that now is in about 40% of K12 schools. Uh, so, so that was a wild ride.
1:44
Um, and then kind of stumbled my way into entrepreneurship now and climate resilience or just, you know, community resilience to physical risk of hurricanes, disa- wildfires, severe storms, um, by, uh, joining a 25-year-old organization that sent a bunch of money to charity after disasters and realized, "Hey, we have a lot more...
2:07
Like, we send a lot of money in times of disasters. Where does that money go? These disasters are closer apart, and they're more deadly.
2:13
And, oh, we have a lot more headed our way, but there's no system for coordinating how to make sure that we're actually getting in front of the problem and not just consistently rebuilding the same stuff over and over."
2:25
So, um, that became the problem to obsess over, and then it was, like, a journey of, all right, well, what is our role in doing that? What are the leverage points, and what should we do?
2:33
And that's how current company, Resiliency Company, was born. So, um, and that's just doing whatever it takes to make that wildly successful.
2:41
So one of the things that I've been realizing about myself is, and you said it, was like, you find a problem, you latch onto it, and you figure out how to solve it.
2:49
I think what I'm, what I've been realizing for myself is after all this time as a creator, I've been so es- I've been so attached to problem statements, and I'm just like, "I am sick of solving problems.
3:00
I just wanna create. [laughs] I just wanna create something."
3:02
Um, so I've kind of, like, swung to the other end of this s- spectrum where I, I understand, like, the thing you create has to have value to it, which means ultimately it does have to solve a problem.
3:12
But I'm kind of, like, burned out on this problem approach to some extent, and I think that's part of why I've gone through what I've gone through.
3:19
But, like, what's your secret sauce to keeping just engaged with a problem day after day after day? I'm now in a space where, uh, the news is making the case for the problem for me.
3:31
Um, so I actually don't have to, like, admire the problem anymore. Like, we see it. 25 times a year, we have a disaster in this country that's over a billion dollars. Um, so, like,
3:43
what I, what I think is interesting is, like, I actually don't have to admire the problem. Like, it's on our doorstep all the time.
3:48
And you just enter a conver- You enter a Zoom conversation, the first thing you talk about with people is the weather and how weird it's getting. Uh, s- And it's like, yeah, guess what? That's gonna keep happening.
3:58
So, uh, there, there's an element of, I think I'm probably in the same place as you.
4:04
Like, we describe ourselves as a do tank because we're not admiring the problem, and I, like, get in a bunch of rooms where people just wanna talk about it.
4:10
Whereas, so what most of the time we talk about are the specific, like, systems or flow of capital or networks that need to change to deal with this problem.
4:22
And so that becomes, like, the forcing function of, like, all right, we can't build homes the way that we've done for the past hundred years. We need to do it differently, and it's hard to get people to change.
4:34
So that's kind of, I think, what, what keeps me obsessed with not the problem, but the leverage points to, like, get at the outcome of, all right, we actually just need to transform all the infrastructure and housing in this country to deal with our future.
4:47
Um, who's gonna do that? Uh, the thing that was really hard for me was what is our role in that? 'Cause there was, like, a million things we could have done.
4:57
Um, but, like, what, what's gonna be the most impactful thing that will get at the outcome? At one point in time, we were gonna start a fund 'cause that sounded fun. I was like, "Oh, I want to start a fund."
5:06
Um, and then we, like, I went a little bit deeper. I was like, all right, it's gonna take 10 years to, before we know if we're gonna s- be successful. We need a boatload of money to do that.
5:14
We need to be good at picking winners and losers on who's gonna do this. And, like, there were just a million reasons.
5:18
So when I came at it with the solution, I would have done the wrong thing if it wasn't more about, like, the leverage points of, like, what will work.
5:27
Feels like you're like, "I want to build a thing," and you have the, like- Yeah... this idea of the problem it solves, but... Yeah.
5:34
I'm in a place right now where I've got all this energy and, um, creativity coursing through me, and I have a lot of assumptions about what I think the problem is and, like, what people are looking for. Mm.
5:44
And so for me, it's really what I've recognized as a pattern in myself is I spend all this time creating and trying to perfect something before I put it out there, and I don't even- Oh, yeah...
5:52
the truth is, I don't even know if it's the right problem to be solving or not. Yeah.
5:56
But it's because I have this problem avoidance where I'm like, "I just wanna make something for me."So I'm ki- I'm like working through that and what that looks like in different ways.
6:03
Being wrong in public is scary, but it's kind of like the best way to know if you're onto something. Yeah. And, and that's, that's something I've gotten c- not comfortable with. I've become accepting of, I guess- Mm-hmm.
6:15
Mm-hmm... um, in the, in the last couple, couple of months. For yourself and as a people leader, the pace of life is like insane right now. The tools, the, the FOMO of falling behind in AI and all that kind of stuff.
6:27
Um, w- help me understand, like what are the things you're recognizing about yourself when it comes to like the emotions of what it's like to be working right now, the feeling of how it's like to be working and then coming home to a family or, you know, just closing your laptop and your family's right there?
6:40
What are the, what's the, what's the emotional and, um, uh, the emotional stuff that you're noticing in yourself and your teams that are...
6:49
Um, but actually I think most of my like observations in the past five years as a leader has mostly been the result of like shifting to a much more remote culture. Mm-hmm.
7:00
Um, uh, that then like AI is perpetuating, but we've, like every business that I have built in the past three years has been totally remote, and, um, uh, there's like pros and cons of that.
7:14
But where I get the most energy of we're on the right track, we're doing something meaningful, um, where I feel like very fulfilled at work is because I get on a plane and go somewhere, um, which like sucks.
7:30
Um, so it's both like giving and like... All right, I, I think I'm, I, I think I'm on my 25th flight this year and it's April. Um, so it- Good call...
7:39
it's like the, it's, it's one of those things, but like that is the thing that moves the business the fastest, builds authentic relationships with people, and gets to like the
7:50
on-the-ground work of proving value in an ecosystem, in a place, and building relationships. Like businesses move at the speed of trust is still true, um, no matter what.
8:02
Partnerships, getting stuff done, building trust, like all of that is still wildly in person, and I think that, um, I kinda forgot that for a couple years.
8:14
And it's like one of the most impactful things that I can do as a leader is get on a plane and go, like, whether it's internal or external, like build a real relationship with somebody, and AI's not gonna replace that.
8:27
So what's the stuff that you're seeing when it comes to AI, whether it's you or your team? I'm constantly battling this like low hum of anxiety that I'm not learning it fast enough or using it the right way.
8:37
So I just had my first experience where I had to let somebody go because of AI slap. Really?
8:42
Um, and it was, it was incredibly difficult to navigate because my, um, default setting is like, all right, I gotta coach around this, right? Like, great, hey.
8:52
Uh, but, but what I realized is that there was this person who was so dependent on AI that he didn't have an original thought. So recognize like, oh, he's outsourcing his thinking.
9:01
It was things that, you know, you see and you're like, "Oh, how is this gonna work?" So I tried to coach, and i- it was just a crutch.
9:08
Like I, I think at the end of the day, he was wildly insecure about the quality of his work, was outsourcing the thinking.
9:14
So that was a new, like, leadership experience for me that kinda calibrated the speed of AI and the speed of learning it, and we're not hiring a robot to do that work.
9:27
Yes, a robot can go prospect, and can go create sales sheet, and can go do this, but the actual, like, outcomes of the work have to be led by a person in this function.
9:37
So that was, that was like a very humbling experience around the pace of AI that like both made me felt sad, uh, 'cause this was like, you know, young guy in his career who was hungry to work and couldn't do it.
9:49
So anyway, like that, that's been my recent leadership experience. But I'm not in the business of creating software anymore, so I, I don't know. It's mostly like a how do you integrate it into work?
9:59
Gosh, that is a we- that is a weird thing to have to deal with. What about you? Is that like anxiety of speed? Uh- For me-... where, where does that come from? I'm kinda like- Yeah...
10:09
am I, am I an old dog that can't learn new tricks? [laughs] Yeah, that's what I started asking myself. So I'm, I'm trying to do so many things at the same time.
10:16
I'm, I'm just always constantly telling myself, "Oh, there should be a way. I should be doing this better." I've kinda taken the stance recently, like I'm not doing any more, I'm not outsourcing my writing.
10:24
I'm, like everything I write- Yeah... is gonna be 100% me. But like research obviously, like organizing, organizing information, automating tasks.
10:33
I'm just trying to figure out like how can I be more effective and 10X myself with the tools? I just have a problem learning the tool well enough to like put it into motion to be an asset for me. Mm-hmm.
10:43
Slowing down for that 30 minutes to create the skill or the recurring task or the process or whatever feels insurmountable 'cause I'm always just trying to go faster. Have you done the pie chart exercise? No.
10:55
What's that? Uh, so, so, so I, I did this when I first, uh, took my job at, at For Good, which is each week I would just have like, here are the four buckets of where I spend time, and I, I, each...
11:08
It wasn't, uh, precise, but it was directional of like here's, here's where I'm spending my time doing specific things across these different, uh, like sections.
11:16
And I did that kind of analysis for, I don't know, like three months of like here's where all my time is going.
11:23
And then what I, I realized is I like looked at how the pie charts would ebb and flow, and then like took a look at it. I was like, all right, what are the things that are actually like rote and I should delegate?
11:33
Like got an EA to do some things. And so there was, it was basically like a reflection of for you, writing is something like you can't give up, but all of the research.
11:42
So there was like a time allocation element of like where is my time truly going and where should I like protect my time because I need to do it? I'm not convinced that the 10X goal is the, is the right frame.
11:59
Um, but it's mostly like a how do I like one-tenth the rote stuff so that the, uhThe one, the, the percent that I get to keep is precious, and I have- That's a-...
12:16
the space for. That's a good reframe. I like that. Thanks. [laughs] Talk a little bit about what you're up to, what you're excited about, and what you're building.
12:27
So I'll, I'll talk on Resiliency Company work, um, because that's where, like, most of my time, energy, brain space, creativity goes. Um, it- so, uh, I spent, like, 20 years,
12:41
uh, in some sort of software where we were building, uh, like, SaaS or software technology. Um, and now I don't, uh...
12:50
the stuff that we are building are financial funds and, like, new vehicles for how money moves in a system.
12:58
Uh, we're building, like, kind of convenings and networks and, and, like, how do you get people to change, change management, and we're, are out- we measure success in the outcome of the physical world.
13:08
Like, how are houses built differently? How are, like, roads and buildings? Like, so there's very much a new, like, physical world element that I have entered into that is a totally new domain.
13:23
Um, it still is being, you know, technology's still totally gonna shift all of those processes, but, like, the world in which what, like, success is, I g- I, it's, like, more hands in the dirt.
13:35
Like, I went and I get to tour a building, I get to tour an R&D facility where they actually, like, simulate hurricanes and light buildings on fire to see how successful they do or don't burn. So, like,
13:49
I, uh, I'll send you a really interesting podcast that got, that, like, kind of tipped my, uh, creative problem-solving around, like, the next wave of incredible businesses are going to be about how we move in the physical world, how we change the physical world, not the digital world.
14:09
Um, and so that is something that, like, I, I kind of always thought of myself as like, "Oh, I'm gonna build software to make people, tools easier" but, like, no, I wanna build stuff and cities and communities where people live and breathe and experience and are, you know, safer and can thrive.
14:27
That, it's, like, such a different world and context that, um, I, I believe that the biggest, like, opportunities and place for creativity are not in the digital world. They're in the physical world.
14:38
Well, I love that take. What are some of the driving things you see behind it? What are you observing that kind of has you convicted of that? Not that I, I don't disagree. I'm just, it's music to my ears.
14:47
I'm just like, what, what, how do you experience it? So, uh, like, there's the, there's some of, like, the macro conditions, which is like, all right, the speed to build software right now is so easy.
14:56
Like, the barrier to entry is really low, and I think we're gonna go build a bunch of st- like, peop- people can build a bunch of stuff, and I hope that that's true because subject matter experts and people that were, like, kept out of great ideas will be brought in, and we'll create a bunch of stuff.
15:09
But we're never, we are still humans that have to make their way through the world and sit with people in community and talk about loneliness epidemic.
15:16
Like, there's just such a need for community that, um, I, I think we're all gonna, like, whether it's nostalgia or just the reality of, like, our world and built environment, we have to, like,
15:30
that, that's the place to, that's the place to go, um, especially if we automate, outsource, and change the way we live as it's more time to create and do and live.
15:41
So, uh, creating the right frame for that is really exciting. We na- we named the company The Resiliency Company because it's, like, resiliency is, like, how you adapt and bounce back to change.
15:52
We're gonna go through so much changes.
15:54
We're focused on the physical world change of, like, what disasters and hazards and heat are gonna do and how we make sure that we can continue to live and thrive in this change, but this is, um, this is gonna be a, a
16:08
opportunity that we have to get good at for the next 100 years.
16:12
Um, so it's, like, one of those problems that, like, this needs to live on well past anything that we're gonna do, and I don't know how long, like, software's gonna live on in some ways.
16:21
Uh, so this is, this is kind of, like, more of a, I don't know, it sounds maybe more, uh, showy than I mean it to. Like, this is, this is the stuff of, like, legacy. So I don't know.
16:30
Those are, those are the two motivating factors. Legacy is a good word. I've been using it a lot more myself. Who, who are you learning from? What are you...
16:39
Any- anybody out there that you're following that's kind of, like, doing more stuff that you think is really good work you wanna shed light on? I'm always looking for people to learn from.
16:46
So much of where I'm learning is, like, just in the world that I haven't been in for 20 years, which is, like, financial and capital markets.
16:56
Like, I can play a finance person on TV, but I'm, like, not one, so it's, like, learning about some of these things.
17:02
Um, kind of ditto with, like, the built environment and, and world of, like, hey, who is talking about, like, innovation in materials and built environment?
17:10
Like, so, so that's, that's where a lot of, like, my stuff that I geek out is. Uh, we actually have a fiscally sponsored project underneath us in The Resiliency Company called Probable Futures.
17:20
Um, and it's founded by, uh, the guy who was the macroeconomist at Wellington Asset Management, and he's a brilliant thinker, and it's called Probable Futures because it's meant to help people understand, like, what the, what our probable futures are gonna look like with climate instability, and he's somebody, he writes these, um, equinox and solstice letters.
17:43
They're really, really long, and he's a brilliant writer and thinker.
17:47
So he's, he's the person who I always send people to is, like, as you're, as you're thinking about what kind of business you wanna build in the world or, uh, what humans are gonna collectively have to do and understand, it's like, you know, once a quarter, it'll come in your inbox, and it'll blow your mind.
18:03
That's awesome.That sounds like it's right up my alley What about you? Uh- Give, give me, right? Question right back at you. Yeah. So I've been, I've been gravitating towards a few of these smaller communities.
18:12
When I was in my marketing role, I found one called Exit Five, which was, like, just for business-to-business marketers. Now I, now I found one, her site, her framework is called Tiny Experiments.
18:22
She wrote a book called Tiny Experiments. She's actually a neuroscience... She's got a neuroscience background. But her site is called Ness Labs, N-E-S-S, and it's just, it's a community- Mm...
18:30
for people that wanna, like, learn by taking small iterative steps. Um, and so those are, those are things that I'm doing. I'm also reading a lot in the just, like, consciousness and awareness and intention space.
18:42
It's, it's a lot more metaphysical and, uh, esoteric- Mm... but there's,
18:48
there's something I'm really drawn to about consciousness and meaning, and maybe we don't have a full comprehensive picture of everything that we're here for. [laughs] So that's a question I'm always exploring.
18:59
No, you're still there. Okay. Okay. How to Really Know If You're- Um, that's the book- Okay... that I'm listening to. Okay. That's the book I'm listening to, and I th- I think you would dig it.
19:10
Um, uh, it's not like the metaphysical and consciousness, but it explains how we build real relationships with people. Um, and it, like, explains how people move through the world. Um, I, I, I'm really enjoying it.
19:26
It's helping me, like, find ways to relate to people. Cool. Yeah, I love that. I pulled it up. So- Thanks for the recommendation... of course. Um- Well, hey- Well, a pleasure. Pleasure as always. Um, reach out anytime.
19:41
Yeah, absolutely. Enjoy the rest of your, uh, time in Cali, and safe travels. Holy cow- Thank you... you're doing a lot of it. Thank you. Thank you. It's crazy. I know. It's too much. [laughs] It's too much.
19:49
It's too much. [laughs] All right. All right. See ya. Well, hey, tell, tell Brian I said hey, and, uh, safe travels. Right back at. Wait, is Keller a freshman? So he actually just decided on his school.
20:00
He's gonna be doing, um, St. Olaf in Minneapolis. Oh, wow. Amazing. Have, have you ever heard of it? Yeah. Yeah, I have. I have a, I have a friend who went there and ran track. No way. Yeah. Okay. From high school. Yeah.
20:14
Interesting. Yeah, it- Yeah... it was totally random, but he's, he's really excited about it. I think it's gonna be a good move for him. Good. So- Is he hoopin', or is he just going to school?
20:23
He's, he's gonna leave the option open to walk on. They actually had...
20:26
Their, their basketball coach that's been there for, like, 15, 20 years is leaving, and so a new coach is coming in at the same time he is, so we'll see. Interesting. We kinda, we kinda took it- Awesome...
20:33
off the table just for his mental health for a little bit, so we'll see what he decides when he's there. Love that. Awesome. Yeah. Well, now that you're gonna be flying over Chicago, you better stop by sometime.
20:44
[laughs] I know. Yeah, we are gonna make a, need to make a trip through there. We're, we're, like, watch- watching- Please come... the Cubs now, and we're like, "Man, we need to make a Chicago trip." Do. Do. So. Cool.
20:55
Uh, you guys- All right. See you soon... will be the first on the list when we do. [laughs] Good. All right. See ya, Abby. See ya. Bye. Bye. [upbeat music]
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